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Thermometer : how to not explode it ? Mm tips video.

#1
Hello everyone. Even if I've been creating in LBP from the beginning, I'm still learning stuff about this game. For example, until recently I just used all stickers and materials I wanted... until the thermometer explodes Sad

Maybe you're like me, and wonder how the thermometer system really works with shapes, emiters, lights or stickers.

I found this old vid from Media Molecule that puts the basics on the thermometer system. It was for LBP1 but most of the rules still applies now.



 
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#2
I too am still learning a few new things from time to time. The thermometer is heavily optimized for PS3, even in LBP3. The PS3's hardware is outdated, even the PS4 hardware is a bit outdated.

Now, the thermometer is more sensitive to materials and decoration. In LBP3 you can try to load in objects with other materials than let's say floor and basic wood when the player approaches it. That creates a system similar to dynamic thermometer (Just with other objects loaded in that are present everywhere and without the bugs). Haven't tested it, so just theory, but from what I've seen, materials and decoration are heavy load.

Sackbots can also be very hard on the thermometer when different costumes are used. Placing down 10 sackbots with individual costumes are very heavy. Try to load them in when the player approaches and delete them when the player is out of the sackbots range.

Interestingly enough, in LBP Vita it's different. Stickers seem to be heavier for the thermometer than materials.
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#3
(11/21/2018, 10:36)mdkd Wrote: Sackbots can also be very hard on the thermometer when different costumes are used. Placing down 10 sackbots with individual costumes are very heavy. Try to load them in when the player approaches and delete them when the player is out of the sackbots range.

Interestingly enough, in LBP Vita it's different. Stickers seem to be heavier for the thermometer than materials.

Yeah, I painfully learned about the different sackbots used ! Specifically for my Zombie Chainsaw Massacre series of levels, where I wanted too many different zombies Sad

Your "load and delete" technic is okay if you want the player to meet specific ennemies several times. Or for NPC's that can't be killed ( I used it in a horror project level for an aggressive dog ). But for sackbots you want to die and give points just once, I think it becomes a bit more complicated than just put the sackbot and let the dynamic thermo works.

That PsVita stuff is interesting and kind of weird. I don't remember if we can play levels from Vita on LB3 ps4.

Anyway, these questions may seem futile for a beginner creator, but they become a real issue when you want to create detailed AND long enough levels. The level link technique has also its limits, when your planet is becoming full of sub-levels. I've started to apply those basic principles in my Tokyo Rooftops level, and it works. Even if the level is not as detailed as I would like, it's long and various enough. 

These questions change my view on the game mechanics, and now I'll try to use more of the same materials, sounds, sackbots and stickers but in different ways, the same shapes, circles or triangles to limit the angles of some objects, all that to give the impression of variety where the game just repeat the same datas.
 
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#4
I see, a horde of zombies instead of single characters. So, I'd say limit it to 4-5 zombies at a time, use a generic zombie costume (Maybe with sticker variation) and try to optimize your stage to 6-10 materials. It can be more, just make sure you're below 50% thermometer usage. I was able to place down 12 zomboe sackbots with the same costume and still have 30-40% space in the thermometer.

I own LBP Vita on PS Vita, that's why I know. Anyway, optimizing in LBP can be painful, but neccessary for long projects. Also, if you want the maximum of 300 levels on your planet use adventure maps. They come with their own problems here and there, but it's confirmed that you can make 20 adventure maps if you wanted to instead of 20 levels.
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#5
(11/22/2018, 07:02)mdkd Wrote: I see, a horde of zombies instead of single characters.
I was able to place down 12 zomboe sackbots with the same costume and still have 30-40% space in the thermometer.

Also, if you want the maximum of 300 levels on your planet use adventure maps. They come with their own problems here and there, but it's confirmed that you can make 20 adventure maps if you wanted to instead of 20 levels.

Hey buddy, thanx for your tips !

Yes a horde of zombies would have been cool, but I learned a long time ago that it's impossible. But your 12 zombots example gives a good indication, thanx. And you're right, LBP (like most games I guess) likes repetition of the same datas. Now I try to do so, and use tricks to give the illusion of variety.

300 levels dispatched in 20 adventure maps, really ? So you can make 15 levels in a map... interesting !
 I thought you were able to build and publish only 3 adventures maps. There are only 3 on your moon. Maybe there's a trick like you build your adventure, export, and publish on your planet directly from the backup map, then you can create another adventure and do the same.

Damn good news then... I was worrying, as I reach 15 on 20 (sub)levels on my planet, but this solution might be super cool. Specially for my "long" series like The Sackboteur and ZCM. I've tried adventure maps... but after some huge bugs I abandonned the idea. I might try it again, thanx Happy

The thing with LBP, as you know my "old" brother of war, is that you have to make copies, save stuff, export backup levels, just in case you encounter a huge bug that breaks an entire level, or worse, your full planet (yes like the Death Star lol).

But maybe real game designers have the same issues. I can imagine me old, still talking about the blue screen bug that breaked my firefighter level just because I wanted 3 changeling characters to speak and change appearence in the same sequencer... like an old cowboy near his firecamp talking like crazy lol... I played too much RDR2 these days ha ha
 
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#6
Every kind of engine has it's limitations. LBP3 has it's fair share. But yeah, the adventure maps are nice. 20 adventure maps with 15 levels each will work. 15 levels in a adventure map still count as one level on your earth. Try it out, it's cool.
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#7
Use wireless logic

Use shapes with the least corners. Triangles are the best but circles are the worst.

Reuse materials and stickers but if u have room just add more then.

Some materials take more thermo then others. Use newest materials since they tend to take less thermo. Also use sticker panel just to place ur logic on.

Use simple logic and if complex tasks needed use a series of simple wireless logic to achieve complex task.

Watchout using broadcast chips. If the logic in those chips are complex and broadcasted on alot of objects it can over heat quickly. So again keep it simple.

Destroy objects or entire sections of a level if the player has already passed them.

Emit objects or sections of a level if it gets too laggy to edit a level in create mode but it should run fine in play mode.
 
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#8
Good tips. I personally heavily use wireless logic to make things go smooth. Deleting finished sections that you can't revisit is also really good.
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#9
(11/26/2018, 22:20)Girps Wrote: Use shapes with the least corners. Triangles are the best but circles are the worst.

Watchout using broadcast chips. If the logic in those chips are complex and broadcasted on alot of objects it can over heat quickly. So again keep it simple.

Hi Girps, and thank you for these tips. 

I'm a bit confused about shapes, because I also thought triangles was the best until now. But in the video, Mm seems to say that the circle has no corner, and so it's the best shape. It's weird because you can clearly see they have multiple corners.

Good point about broadcast chips. A very usefull tool though.
 
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#10
I think triangles are the easiest shape with it's 3 corners.
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